Kim Geun-sik "尹 = toothless tiger...Park Won-seok, "Reversal of approval ratings? Public awareness is already early presidential election."

[YTN Radio News Fighting Youngsoo Kim]

□ Broadcasting: FM 94.5 (07:15-09:00)
□ Broadcast date and time: January 21, 2025 (Tue)
□ Host: Youngsoo Kim Anchor
□ Performers: Kim Geun-sik, former head of the National Power Vision Strategy Office, and Park Won-seok, former lawmaker

* The text below may differ from the actual broadcast content, so please check the broadcast for more accurate information.

[Please clarify that this is the interview content of YTN Radio <News Fighting>]]

◆ Youngsoo Kim Anchor (hereinafter referred to as Youngsoo Kim): Yes, let's move on to part four. Tuesday is a behind-the-scenes time for politics to solve all the inner situations of the political circle. Kim Geun-sik, former head of the People's Power Vision Strategy Office, and Park Won-seok, former lawmaker. It's the first time I've ever done a political analysis with you two. I look forward to your kind cooperation. Because there are so many political issues today, President Yoon's arrest warrant was issued, and there was also a mass court rampage by supporters due to opposition. Let's hear a little bit about how you see the situation over the weekend.

□ Kim Geun-sik, former head of the National Power Vision Strategy Office (hereinafter referred to as Kim Geun-sik): These days, things that are unprecedented in the world are happening in the political history of Korea after martial law, and the incumbent president was arrested and arrested because he had a democratic system as good as Korea. So as president, he was actually imprisoned. Now it's a very shocking thing, and it's surprising that angry supporters of the president actually attacked the most law-abiding building, the court of the judiciary, and did things on a rampage level. So, before I blame anyone and before I hold anyone accountable, it's more than true that Korean politics has come this far. In fact, these are scenes that the foreign media can only pay attention to and look at as a shock, so I only hope that Korean politics can return to normal so that the ruling and opposition parties, Lee Jae-myung or Yoon Suk Yeol, can quickly find stability.

◆ Youngsoo Kim: Yes, what about Representative Park Won-seok?

◇ Park Won-seok: So I expected the situation to progress and clear up after the arrest of President Yoon Suk Yeol, but I'm a little sorry that the chaos seems to continue. So our democracy actually works by rule of law or by agreement and by form. However, such an attack on the court happened in an unfortunate way that should not have happened in a way that completely denies the rule of law, and in the end, President Yoon Suk Yeol showed this attitude of refusing to comply with any acts of the judiciary of the investigative agency and denying the rule of law, which led to the growing anger and anger of supporters, and even now, as long as President Yoon insists on the investigation of the Senior Civil Servant Corruption Investigations Unit or the court's warrant, such violent backlash from supporters will continue, which is very worrisome. I don't know what you're going to say about the Constitutional Court's impeachment hearing today, but if I say the same thing as what I've said before, I think it's only an intention to make the Constitutional Court's impeachment hearing a political agitation ground for gathering supporters. I think President Yoon Suk Yeol should change his mind a little now.

◆ Youngsoo Kim: Yes, how? So, President Yoon's position is that emergency martial law is the president's authority if he has used it as a handwritten manuscript. And it is argued that the opposition's monopoly on the National Assembly has paralyzed the state administration. Then, won't you make the same argument during the impeachment trial?

□ Kim Geun-sik: So I agree with Representative Park Won-seok, but the president will probably repeat the same position when he goes to the Constitutional Court today. So there are some logical connections. First, it is due to the Democratic Party's dominance in legislation. So I think this has actually changed a bit. Of course, there was a lot of legislative dominance. I impeached him. He committed too much parliamentary violence to bulletproof representative Lee Jae-myung's judicial risks. However, we lost the general election to the Democratic Party before the perception that the Democratic Party of Congress was due to the legislative dominance. Then it was a crushing defeat. So what's the cause of the crushing defeat? The people chose Lee Jae-myung over the power of the people. That's why I failed. Then the president should have changed. So many people think that this is because the Democratic Party is the sole legislator, and I agree, but I want to ask these people and President Yoon Suk Yeol. It's your fault. You're wrong in politics, you're against public sentiment, and you lose support, so our party is ruined and we've given the Democratic Party a huge seat. Then, before blaming the Democratic Party after the crushing defeat in the general election, of course, the Democratic Party is largely to blame, but we have to change our attitude. Kim Gun-hee should have been cut off and the state administration should have changed. That's the first one. The second logic is that that's all I can do as president, so I declared martial law as an emergency. You shouldn't do what you shouldn't do just because you're blaming yourself for the legislative dominance and the abuse of impeachment. You can't cross the line that you can't cross. Since you killed me, I'll kill you, too. Is this the only logical thing you can do?

◆ Youngsoo Kim: You both feel the same way.

□ Kim Geun-sik: And the third one. I think that's why all of these things are linked to rigged elections. So the most fundamental justification for not taking responsibility and not self-reflection is that this is not my fault. It's a fraudulent election. It's a very convenient logic. If I do this logic again today, the Constitutional Court will do it again. If so, I was the president of our party, but I can only do this with lonely wolf syndrome. He's just sitting in his own room and being trapped in a cave where he justifies himself. It's very frustrating.

◇ Park Won-seok: I think you can make that argument for self-defense, but anyway, he is still the incumbent president. Then, we must respect our rule of law and have a minimum respect for the systems, procedures, and subjects that enforce the law anyway. But now, without any of that, if you start to argue that everything is some kind of judicial cartel on the left and some kind of conspiracy, as a result. Whether it is in the Constitutional Court or in criminal justice proceedings, it will result in urging one's own order. Because from the Constitutional Court's point of view, there is already a great confusion and gap in our constitutional system, and it is also the Constitutional Court's responsibility to quickly end it anyway to eliminate uncertainty. But if the accused, President Yoon Suk Yeol, continues to stir up his supporters with that kind of incitement, he should finish this impeachment proceeding as soon as possible. Isn't this the judgment? I think I'm kind of in a situation where I'm self-confident right now.

◆ Youngsoo Kim: I see. Today is the third day of the impeachment trial. They're going to attend and talk in person, so I'll let you know when I get another breaking news. I think it will be in the afternoon. But this court rampage. The current offenders were arrested for this incident, and half of them are in their 20s and 30s.

□ Kim Geun-sik: I think this is also a part that we need to analyze a little bit. Some of you might have analyzed this a little too much, and right after martial law, wasn't there a million people in Yeouido with a ring pattern? There were also relatively many women in their 20s and 30s there. So, the gender conflict has been based on the extreme division of our society, but the two political positions of pro-impeachment, anti-impeachment, criticism of Yoon Suk Yeol, and advocacy of Yoon Suk Yeol have been relatively gender-dividing. I'm also very concerned. And even if these extreme right-wing aspects of these men are carried out, they need to be analyzed, but the extreme right-wing haters called Ilbae in the past, and now the New Men's Solidarity, which was behind it, is a symbol of gender conflict between men and women, but now there is a successor to the Men's Solidarity, which was made into an NGO. And if there are young men who think of discrimination, hatred, and exclusion as their political justification and nourishment while thinking about this extreme idea that now reaches the white bone, it is a very big problem. It's a big social issue, too. Now, I think these are also the trends that have become a political establishment as a social phenomenon, not as a matter of favoring and opposing impeachment. I don't think we should pretend we don't know this and we shouldn't turn a blind eye to it. I also think it is necessary to analyze this very accurately and properly deal with it for the unity and unity of our society and for the future of society.

◆ Youngsoo Kim: Resolving this conflict is the very basis of politics. Society has no choice but to have a conflict structure, and whether it is progressive or conservative, the role of politics is to heal the conflict with conflict, so the role of politics is more important now. More than 50% of young people in their 20s and 30s are now arrested. There is a high possibility that a warrant will be requested right now.

◇ Park Won-seok: So I think it's a very worrisome phenomenon, as Professor Kim Geun-sik said. We need to check in-depth what background and why they participated in the protest by acting so violently, but anyway, that's a phenomenon that's being expressed. So, within the scope of normal conservatism, young people in their 20s and 30s make their own arguments or have their own worldview. I don't think that's going to be that problematic. Now, the actions of that early morning in the Western District Court were like a kind of far-right activism, far-right fascism, far-right terrorism that went beyond the limits of normal conservatism. It is necessary to look at why they have come to act like that, so there are things to look at separately from legally punishing and punishing them, and what social backgrounds and economic backgrounds appear in that flow and that collective flow. Ilbe also mentioned earlier and talked about the New Men's Solidarity. In order to gain comfort from the alienation and alienation that men in their 20s and 30s have in our society, the extreme world view, especially on online YouTube, such as China Out, fraudulent election conspiracy theories, and the paths that are expressed through religious mediation, will not be gathered or expressed in an abnormal form. But I think politics should think about that.

◆ Youngsoo Kim: I see. Then, what do the ruling and opposition politicians think? In the case of the Democratic Party, it is now defined as the second civil war. The ruling party claims that it is also responsible for the excessive investigation by the Senior Civil Servant Corruption Investigations Unit. How do you see the responsibility battle between the ruling and opposition parties?

□ Kim Geun-sik: So, as I said earlier, you shouldn't calculate your own advantages and disadvantages politically for the intrusion of the Western District Court this time. So, as you said right now, the Democratic Party covers this with a frame of rebellion again, and develops the frame by saying that the power of the people is the actor's mediation behind them and the president of Yoon Suk Yeol apologizes behind them. It's kind of blaming everything on civil war and martial law. And I think it's the same for our party. This should be firmly drawn against violent acts or any collective actions that are far-right, but this is not the only fault, but the Senior Civil Servant Corruption Investigations Unit is also to blame. This is the same thing that President Yoon Suk Yeol blamed others earlier. You have to look back on yourself and reflect on yourself, and our party has to break up and separate them for sure that it has nothing to do with them, but you can't talk about them as if you're defending them. As mentioned earlier, this extreme gender conflict is emerging in our society like a big pus of future generations. In order for politicians to solve these problems, they need to listen to their stories, listen to their inner feelings, and think about how to adjust and integrate them, and use them as their own political party. So, politics is rather encouraging conflict, and politics is formed on top of that conflict. I really don't think this kind of politics should continue. I think it's a little too much for the Democratic Party to put on such a frame of rebellion, the party's denial of its foot, and the Senior Civil Servant Corruption Investigations Unit to blame.

◆ Youngsoo Kim: What do you think about the response of the ruling and opposition parties?

◇ Park Won-seok: No, regardless of whether it's legally a civil war or not, it's a political aspect. In the end, President Yoon Suk Yeol's refusal to comply with the rule of law and the power of the people will protect it and protect it. I think they point out that this kind of appearance is an extension of the civil war in this sense, whether it has affected and connected to the behavior of such extreme supporters. However, both the ruling and opposition parties should take seriously that this is the phenomenon caused by the disastrous failure of politics, and I must firmly draw the line that the frustration of the people's power is such a violent form that cannot be tolerated in a democratic society. And if there is a problem with the Senior Civil Servant Corruption Investigations Unit, we should strictly punish and investigate and reveal it. Nevertheless, for example, if there is a problem with the Senior Civil Servant Corruption Investigations Unit, we should say this, but if we put this as almost the same weight, it seems that this is bad and that is bad. In the end, it seems that the Democratic Party is only trying to protect that phenomenon or reduce that problem. So, the Democratic Party of Korea cannot help but be criticized for defending the wrong martial law or rebellion that President Yoon Suk Yeol did.

◆ Youngsoo Kim: I hope the ruling and opposition parties will look at this issue in the mid- to long-term and come up with measures. Among other issues, the Senior Civil Servant Corruption Investigations Unit forced President Yoon to be recruited at night. It lasted for six hours, but in the end, we couldn't find a job. Of course, it is said that the possibility of retrying forced recruitment has also been left open. How did you see it?

□ Kim Geun-sik: I was wrong to declare martial law by the president. I was wrong to refuse to comply with an official request for attendance by a law enforcement agency that led to arrest. However, that is why Korea is now the 10th largest economy in the world. It's an advanced country. Don't you all know the Korean Wave? I don't know what the Senior Civil Servant Corruption Investigations Unit is thinking about in this country, but they arrested him anyway. The arrest was broadcast live and he was taken into custody. The arrest was broadcast live, and eventually, this kind of intrusion by the court occurred. But the Senior Civil Servant Corruption Investigations Unit came again and was imprisoned. So, it's not a casual outfit, but a person who changed into that camp's clothes, went through prison procedures, took a mug shot, and is now in. I'm a sitting president. Do you think you'll go to this person and applaud him for doing a good job because he's not playing the media for a long time for six hours, and he's not disgracing himself. From what I see, since the launch of the Senior Civil Servant Corruption Investigations Unit, there have been no achievements for years since the launch of the Senior Civil Servant Corruption Investigations Unit, and the ruling and opposition parties have criticized me, so I think you're going to take this opportunity to play with the president properly, but you don't have to do that. Don't you have to hand it over to the prosecution in a little while? That's a lot. There's a story about a child like this. No, it's the president. Still, it's not beneficial for the president to go and try to pull him out by stretching him out for six hours, and to pose as if he's pressuring a suspect who doesn't respond, but I don't understand why he's doing that.

◆ Youngsoo Kim: The Senior Civil Servant Corruption Investigations Unit says this. I asked for an investigation on the 16th, 17th, 19th, and 20th, but they kept refusing to comply. He expressed his position that he had no choice but to seek compulsory recruitment because he refused to comply.

◇ Park Won-seok: No, so legally, if the arrested suspect goes to the prosecution office or goes to visit, but goes to the investigation room, and it doesn't come out, then of course, the investigative agency has no choice but to review the forced recruitment. That's a procedure, but considering the status of the incumbent president, the shape is very trivial. Then you can't really go in and physically drag it out, and you're asking me to keep responding to the investigation, but I don't think President Yoon Suk Yeol has any intention of responding to any investigation by the Senior Civil Servant Corruption Investigations Unit. However, time is passing for the Senior Civil Servant Corruption Investigations Unit, and 10 days later, I have to hand it over to the prosecution, but I don't know if I will respond to the prosecution' So the question of investigative power is similar. Just as the Senior Civil Servant Corruption Investigations Unit does not have direct investigation rights for rebellion, so does the prosecution. However, since he was a prosecutor, I expect him to respond to the prosecution's investigation. In that sense, I sympathize with the earlier statement that it is not beneficial, but if you do not keep holding on to it, it will be silent anyway. In that case, why don't you just hand it over to the prosecution quickly? I think that's why the prosecution has secured a considerable amount of evidence. Because the prosecution has investigated and prosecuted Minister Kim Yong-hyun and other accomplices, the prosecution is also quite prepared. No, since you are a former prosecutor, the Senior Civil Servant Corruption Investigations Unit scheduled for 10 days to go to the prosecution for investigation, but I also think that why don't we transfer the case to the prosecution a little earlier than 10 days and have the prosecution investigate and prosecute the rest of it?

◆ Youngsoo Kim: I see. It is the first time that the former and incumbent presidents who have been imprisoned have tried to force recruitment.

□ Kim Geun-sik: So, there are cases where the prosecution tried to investigate the former president at the time, but did not respond, and there were cases where a door-to-door investigation was conducted but did not take place. So did the former president. But what kind of side effects will happen to the public if the Senior Civil Servant Corruption Investigations Unit seems to be too eager to investigate the incumbent president and treats the president only as a real suspect, so the president should be punished because he did it wrong. Most people agree with this idea, but even if you do it a little, it's too much. There's a saying that goes too far. You have to do it in moderation. From the perspective of the people's power, I'm really sad and sorry that the president is the president we produced, but isn't he a sitting president and a politician? And now that he is a current president as a political leader, I can only think that the Senior Civil Servant Corruption Investigations Unit has another intention to insult and humiliate him like this. There's no real benefit. As Rep. Park Won-seok said earlier, we can't even indict him anyway. And wouldn't it be investigated? Then, you have to hand it over to the prosecution quickly and write an indictment that the prosecution has to prosecute, so it's better to hand it over because you have a lot of evidence related to the indictment. Stop disgracing yourself and I think the Senior Civil Servant Corruption Investigations Unit is too much.

◆ Youngsoo Kim: I see. Let's move on to the next issue. When President Yoon was arrested, Kwon Young-se, chairman of the emergency committee, said that if the charges are confirmed, Lee Jae-myung should be arrested in the same way and legal equity should be observed. Do you think it is necessary to put the two judicial judgment agreements on the line?

□ Kim Geun-sik: That's right. So the judicial system itself is going according to the procedures of the incumbent president who is suspected of rebellion, and the Republic of Korea is a powerful country in some ways. Then, equally, I think that it should proceed with representative Lee Jae-myung. You're undergoing five trials right now. So, he is a criminal accused and the leader of the opposition party who is accused of a crime. However, if you look at what he has done so far, we can't say that we did a good job with the president of Yoon Suk Yeol, but more people are very tired of representative Lee Jae-myung. The attitude of going to trial at the time of the trial, the attitude of taking part in sit-ins one day while fasting sick and taking time to come, and recommending only lawmakers who listen well to them as candidates, making lawmakers and using them for bulletproof purposes, and even being convicted of the Public Official Election Act in the first trial, but don't you know that he did everything to drag him back to the second trial? I'm the leader of the main opposition party, but the address is unknown. I can't bring you anything because the door is closed. I dragged it out for a month because I didn't receive this trial document. It's this kind of person. I also postpone my attendance at the trial because there is a plenary session, and the people blame the president, but I think representative Lee Jae-myung is too much. So, I think a lot about the public sentiment of the people, if the president had reached that point, it would be Lee Jae-myung's turn, and of course, this would be done by the judicial system. The trial will proceed, but please be sincere in the trial, accept the results of the trial, and if any legal ruling comes out on the trial, the people are also looking at it as it is and reflecting on it, and I think it should be left to the judgment of the court whether this will be an arrest or a court.

◆ Youngsoo Kim: The Democratic Party argues that Lee Jae-myung or how can we put this on the same line?

◇ Park Won-seok: So I have nothing more to say about the power of the people now. After all, hitting Lee Jae-myung
I think I decided to repeat this now. President Yoon Suk Yeol can no longer defend himself. In addition, since Lee Jae-myung does not show any respect for the rule of law, he believes that Lee Jae-myung is only talking about this, so the two cases are different in character, material, and gravity. And since the courts are different and within one judicial system, but they are in charge of different cases, they will each judge according to the gravity of the case and accordingly according to the principles of the law. Unless you have a total distrust of the Korean judicial system, you don't have to say this, and the fact that Lee Jae-myung's warrant was reviewed and nevertheless not arrested is a decision within the current judicial system. However, now that the Yoon Suk Yeol has been arrested, Lee Jae-myung should also be arrested. How on earth is that logic? I think that's just my frame. I have nothing more to say. So, in the end, there is nothing left for the people other than hitting Lee Jae-myung. I think it's showing this.

□ Kim Geun-sik: I think that's because the president of Yoon Suk Yeol is now a toothless tiger. I'm a sitting president who is imprisoned and I'm a sitting president who changes into that camp clothes. I don't know what the Democratic Party of Korea is trying to gain by talking about rebellion or anything to President Yoon Suk Yeol, but it's Lee Jae-myung everywhere, but it's a civil war everywhere. The Democratic Party, however, believes that the civil war is no longer effective because it has now moved on to judicial proceedings. So, I think such public sentiment is working, so we are not Lee Jae-myung, but Lee Jae-myung is the most likely leader of the main opposition party alive and the person who actually holds the most power. That's why I'm criticizing you. I don't think I should be on the same level as a toothless tiger.

◆ Youngsoo Kim: Yes, there are a lot of pending political issues today, so let me talk about the results of the recent polls. Political circles have different interpretations. The ruling and opposition parties seem to have different positions as a result of recent polls showing the power of the people and the approval rating of the Democratic Party of Korea outside the margin of error. What do you think of the recent polls?

□ Kim Geun-sik: I think that's also a reflection of the public sentiment that I mentioned earlier, Lee Jae-myung. So, the Democratic Party of Korea is asking why only Lee Jae-myung keeps increasing, but Lee Jae-myung is a strong person. I'm the current opposition leader. Isn't the Democratic Party the most overwhelming presidential candidate? So there are many people's predictions that this person will become president. The reason why our party comes out higher than the Democratic Party in the various polls you just said about the prediction is not strange, but yes, the Yoon Suk Yeol is now leaving. Since the Yoon Suk Yeol now has to go through the procedures of the Constitutional Court and judicial investigation agencies, it is now a tiger without teeth. I'm a exhausted wild boar. Then, rather than thinking of continuing to hit the people's power over this person, but since Yoon Suk Yeol Lee leaves, now Lee Jae-myung will become president, but there are many people who are worried that if Lee Jae-myung becomes president, he will do more than Yoon-sung. In my opinion, which party do you support in recent polls? The Democratic Party of Korea, which has been reduced to a toothless tiger with a Yoon Suk Yeol out and a Yoon Suk Yeol out, and Lee Jae-myung is still the power of the people.

◆ Youngsoo Kim: There are more answers from the conservatives. So I think it's the Democratic Party's idea that this trend appears in the polls.

□ Kim Geun-sik: It could be oversampled. Oversampling happens at any stage and at any political time.

◇ Park Won-seok: Professor Kim Geun-sik seems to have interpreted it very hopefully, but it is true that there have been more conservative responses. This is now corrected because gender, age, or region have objective standards according to demographics, so political or ideological tendencies cannot be corrected. Recently, however, conservative supporters have responded a lot to the polls, and among them, high-ranking political officials have responded a lot, resulting in this result. But that is not the only thing. In particular, if you look at the public opinion of the middle class, the response that impeachment is still in favor of impeachment is similar. However, if you look at the party's approval rating and the presidential candidate's approval rating, there are many answers that are slightly different from waiting and seeing or relocating. So that means impeachment is impeachment and presidential election is presidential election. I think we should read the meaning between the lines in terms of the fact that we have already begun to recognize this situation as an early presidential election.

◆ Youngsoo Kim: I see. The response is based on the early presidential election.

◇ Park Won-seok: The Yoon Suk Yeol is over now. This perception is common. The Yoon Suk Yeol is over, and now the polls show that they are answering with early presidential elections in mind. So, what the Democratic Party should be wary of is that the impact of impeachment on the early presidential election may not be as great as expected. It was overwhelming during the impeachment in 2016. At that time, I actually didn't know what to do. However, this time, the impact may not be as significant as then because of the overlapping learning effects, and one of the reasons is that unlike candidate Moon Jae In, the limitation of the unfavorable expandability of representative Lee Jae-myung comes out in the opinion polls, which is a task that Chairman Lee Jae-myung or the Democratic Party of Korea should solve somehow.

□ Kim Geun-sik: So, if we accurately analyze that the direction the party leadership is taking is not right, if we look at the strange phenomenon that the people's power that President Yoon Suk Yeol has lost is far higher than the Democratic Party, which cannot exclude Chairman Lee Jae-myung, in order for us to really re-create and re-create the government in the presidential election. Our party needs to separate the president of Yoon Suk Yeol. They have to separate themselves, but they keep looking at these polls strangely, and they mistake the far-right people who are making a fuss as if they have gone ahead and their support has gone up. Rather, if you carry the president of Yoon Suk Yeol, you can't get the nourishment of the public sentiment based on this good public sentiment. So, if only the president of Yoon Suk Yeol says we're going to cut it off, and if the people's power is renewed and new conservative, new innovation, new changes, the Democratic Party of Korea cannot bring out Lee Jae-myung. It's really hard over there. Since it is Americanized, we can fight and win against Lee Jae-myung's one-way system. I think this is the flow of public sentiment right now.

◆ Youngsoo Kim: I see. It is said that the Democratic Party has formed a special polling committee. So, he was scheduled to visit the polling agency site, but for now, it was confirmed that the NEC conducted a related investigation, so he decided to postpone the decision to visit. What do you think of the Democrats forming a special committee?

◇ Park Won-seok: Well, I don't think it's a good response. Anyway, unless a poll is a very absurd manipulation, that is also an indicator of the flow of public sentiment, and if conservatives are over-represented now, there is a possibility that the Democratic Party's supporters may have been overrepresented at some point in the past. It's not a very good response.

◆ Youngsoo Kim: I see. It's almost time. I think I need to wrap it up here. Thank you both for coming out today. Let me introduce you to the poll on the party's approval rating that I mentioned just a moment ago. This is the result of an ARS survey conducted by Realmeter at the request of the Energy Economy Newspaper from the 16th to the 17th by wire-free mixing. For more information, please refer to the website of the Central Election Public Opinion Review Committee. Thank you.