[News NIGHT] President Yoon's impeachment trial is in person...a total denial of the allegations

■ Host: anchor Sung Moon-gyu
■ Starring: Hong Seok-joon, former member of the National Power, Shin Hyun-young, former member of the Democratic Party of Korea,

* The text below may differ from the actual broadcast content, so please check the broadcast for more accurate information. Please specify [YTN News Special] when quoting.


[Anchor]
Yoon attended the third hearing of the impeachment trial in person. It is also the first time for an impeached president to appear at the Constitutional Court's trial. Hong Seok-joon, a former member of the People's Power, and Shin Hyun-young, a former member of the Democratic Party, are in the studio. Hello, both of you. For the first time in constitutional history, an incumbent president attended the impeachment trial. President Yoon emphasized liberal democracy in his first remarks today.
I'll hear that comment myself.

[President Yoon Suk Yeol: I am sorry to the judges ★ for making you suffer from my impeachment case even though you are working heavily due to various constitutional lawsuits. I am a person who has lived with a firm belief of ★ liberal democracy since I grew up. As the Constitutional Court is also an institution that exists to protect the Constitution, ★ I ask the judges to take a good look at it in many ways ★. ]

[Anchor]
Today's remarks are said to have been made by raising hands and requesting them almost simultaneously as soon as the impeachment trial began. I have released a video of a public statement or attended an arrest examination, but this is the first time I have spoken in public like this. Is there a reason why you're here today? What do you think?

[Hong Seok-jun]
From the beginning of President Yoon Suk Yeol, I will attend the Constitutional Court directly. And they asked us to do a live broadcast, didn't they? Nevertheless, the Constitutional Court answered that the related system and regulations were insufficient, so it could not be broadcast live on the spot, but it would be delayed. From today on, I think there is a lot of possibility that the president will go out and talk about why he did the emergency martial law and what the process was like.
Because what has been in the media so far has been mainly investigated by the prosecution, it is likely that the military commanders, including former Minister Kim Yong-hyun, will talk from their own point of view or to escape their responsibility, and because the statements are likely to be tainted or inaccurate, I think they will continue to go as soon as possible because they know the entire process and need to clearly talk about what they have done and have not done as president.

[Anchor]
I'm going to record it and send it to you now.Ma may think that it is an opportunity to inform the general public of his position directly because he can hear the real remarks made by President Yoon.

[Hyunyoung Shin]
According to the testimony of the impeachment prosecutors at the scene, President Yoon said that there was a scene where he looked weak and a little anxious in a way. In fact, there was a judgment that President Park Geun Hye was impeached because he had never attended the Constitutional Court in person and did not actively respond, so I will actively respond to President Yoon Suk Yeol this time. In particular, as a former prosecutor general, I was confident that I was the best, so I must have a little distrust of the spokespeople and thought that I should make my own defense. If you think about today's testimony, President Yoon Suk Yeol's approval rating dropped every time he did doorstep, spoke to the public, and held a press conference. I think that's what happened today as well. On the other hand, while attending in person, didn't a lot of witnesses apply? Isn't it trying to delay the trial of such an impeachment? And I'm still alive to such a big fan in a red tie. He also talked about fraudulent elections today to appeal to the court that he did it with this intention, but those things became emergency rules in a proper procedure for the judges of the Constitutional Court, or why he invaded the National Assembly, invaded the NEC, and how he declared the decree.

[Anchor]
You think today's outfit is meaningful, too.

[Hyunyoung Shin]
It's going to be a message. Didn't Hong Seok-joon also wear a red tie today? It's quite similar. In that sense, I'm wearing blue today. So that's why it can show the message indirectly.

[Anchor]
Today's referee lasted a total of 1 hour and 43 minutes. President Yoon denied or actively explained major issues, but we will look at them separately here. First of all, there was a question of whether President Yoon ordered the establishment of an emergency legislative body at the time of the emergency martial law. President Yoon responded like this. Let's listen to it.

[Moon Hyung-bae / Acting President of the Constitutional Court: Have you ever given a note to the Minister of Strategy and Finance to draw up a budget for emergency legislative bodies? ]

[President Yoon Suk Yeol] ★ I never gave this before ★, and I saw in the article that after a long time after lifting this martial law, ★ there was this memo in the media. ★ The content of the article is a little inaccurate, and then ★The only person who can make this is the defense minister, but the defense minister was arrested at that time and could not confirm it in detail. ★ However, if you look at the contents, the contents of ★ seem to contradict each other.. ★]

[Anchor]
As for the inquiries related to the emergency legislative body, the judge asked almost the same question when the Seoul Western District Court reviewed the warrant last time. The Constitutional Court also asked a question about the emergency legislative body. What do you think is the reason? Representative Shin, please tell us first.

[Hyunyoung Shin]
There's no one who actually gave this note, but there's someone who received it. This could lead to a dispute later, and in particular, acting president Choi Sang-mok is acting as president, so it will be important to discriminate whether or not he participated in the civil war as a member of the State Council at the emergency martial law of the day. In particular, three things are written inside the note. Prepare and secure the reserve as soon as possible. And completely cut off congressional funding. And I think this will be important to draw up a budget for the national emergency legislative body. Because the state's emergency legislative body can be a message to deny the function of the National Assembly and create a separate emergency legislative body to draw up a budget, the content is very important in verifying whether the National Assembly tried to paralyze or disable the function of the National Assembly and create another legislative body similar to the National Security Legislative Council during the Chun Doo-hwan coup. Now, former Defense Minister Kim Yong-hyun has expressed his position that he wrote it, so if the Defense Minister had written it, of course, the president, who is now pointed out as a rebellion mob, could have inspected it once and delivered it to Acting President Choi Sang-mok. In this regard, the Constitutional Court's confirmation of the facts will be an important factor in finding out the suitability of emergency martial law and how far such a state constitutional act has been planned.

[Anchor]
He said he couldn't remember who wrote the note in the arrest examination last time, but today, Minister Kim Yong-hyun is the only one who can use it. But Minister Kim Yong-hyun said this yesterday. Minister Kim wrote it and suggested such a story to the president, this is the position of former Minister Kim Yong-hyun.

[Hong Seok-jun]
That's right. That's why the president said he couldn't remember the arrest warrant when the Seoul District Court examined it, because he basically didn't remember it. That's why Minister Kim Yong-hyun said he did it. And this is the story of Minister Kim Yong-hyun. An emergency legislative body is not something that will completely replace the National Assembly. The emergency legislative body is an organization to secure the budget through emergency economic orders and emergency fiscal orders because the Democratic Party of Korea has only reduced the budget for the first time since the emergency martial law. Therefore, I gave it to the Minister of Economy and Finance, which is the ministry concerned. That's the story. That is why Minister Kim Yong-hyun made it clear yesterday that the emergency legislative body itself is not a body that completely replaces the National Assembly and completely blocks the National Assembly.

[Anchor]
For your information, the acting chief was already last month. On the 17th of last month, I said this in a question about pending issues. The president did not give it to me directly, but said that it was a reference given to me by a working-level official at the meeting, and he covered it up because he felt like a measure on the premise of martial law. Anyway, President Yoon said today that he didn't write this. Let's look at the next issue. President Yoon denied ordering lawmakers to be pulled out to block the National Assembly's resolution to lift martial law. Let's hear that comment for ourselves.

[Moon Hyung-bae / Acting President of the Constitutional Court: Lee Jin-woo, commander of the Water Defense Command, and Kwak Jong-geun, commander of the Special Forces Command, have you ever instructed the National Assembly to bring down lawmakers who gathered in the National Assembly to resolve martial law after declaring martial law? ]

[President Yoon Suk Yeol] None. If the military interfered with the decision made on the night of December 3rd and 4th, then will it no longer be able to demand the lifting of the ★ martial law and continue, I don't think so. ★ ★In Korea, the National Assembly and the media are much stronger than the president ☆ 'super power' ☆. ★ If I force myself not to make a decision on the demand for the lifting of the martial law ★ I can do it in a place other than the National Assembly, and ★ I can ask for the lifting of martial law as much as I want. ★If you say you blocked it, I think it's really something you can't bear the consequences ★. ]

[Anchor]
He said he did not order the lawmakers to be pulled out directly, but during the investigation, most of the commanders testified in common that President Yoon ordered the lawmakers to be pulled out, but they are in a position that runs squarely counter to that.

[Hyunyoung Shin]
That's why I think President Yoon Suk Yeol's testimony is being denied in a way that he just denies what is legally disadvantageous. It is also absurd to say that Commander Lee Jin-woo and Commander Kwak Jong-geun have already testified to the prosecution during the investigation, and that there are people who have heard it directly, but no one has actually ordered it. These are the parts that should be revealed continuously in President Yoon Suk Yeol's criminal investigation process, and if he destroys and denies the evidence, how will he prove it? I think this will also be an important issue in the future. In particular, the president continued to say he would attend if possible at the Constitutional Court, but commander Lee Jin-woo is expected to appear on February 4 and commander Kwak Jong-geun is expected to appear as a witness on February 6, so I think it could be a battle of truth with the parties.

[Anchor]
Senator Hong, how did you hear it?

[Hong Seok-jun]
First of all, in the case of Special Commander Kwak Jong-geun, the statement has been changed so far. So at first, when I asked him when he knew the martial law period, he said he knew after watching the broadcast, but later he said he knew a few days ago, and after that, he asked me to pull the door out, but he said he had never said an ax, and his words kept getting confused. That's why I'm actually a little doubtful about how the commanders understood what the president said he had never given directions in this situation, but there's definitely something like this. If you had decided not to let the National Assembly vote go from the beginning, would you have passed the lawmakers so easily? If you just block it strongly, you just have to block access to the National Assembly. Second, if the intention was to do so from the beginning, lawmakers, especially those who have local constituencies, should do something to prevent this fundamentally, such as Sunday or Saturday, which goes down to their constituencies, but I didn't have that intention to prevent it from the beginning. That's why I think the president's words are quite reliable in these basic matters, whether there was a need for the president to force the lawmakers in the Capitol to be forced out.

[Anchor]
Actually, what's special about Hong Seok-joon and Shin Hyun-young is that we did a broadcast together during martial law. I was really surprised that day, so I listened to it together. Wasn't it too urgent for Representative Hong to say now that lifting martial law would have been so easy?

[Hong Seok-jun]
That's right. What I still remember vividly is that the president said emergency martial law and the anchor were surprised, but I was also locked up because I was told not to leave, and then I was blocked and told to leave, so I was worried and went through the National Assembly. At that time, I saw the traffic jam on the spot, and when I saw it at the scene, I was like that at the time, but I was just passing through the main gate. And I saw a scene where cars got tangled up, so I saw something like, "You didn't have a strong lockdown from the beginning to prevent the National Assembly's decision."

[Anchor]
Representative Shin.

[Hyunyoung Shin]
Representative Hong Seok-joon said earlier, and I'm going to continue to answer. In fact, just because the president of Yoon Suk Yeol does not allow him to vote on the demand for the lifting of martial law, isn't it possible to do it in a place other than the National Assembly? Or you can ask for cancellation as much as you want after that. That's why I think saying this as evidence that there was no intention of obstructing the lifting of martial law is a very mean excuse in a way. I think the National Assembly was able to maintain the plenary session because many party officials opposed it and made various efforts to see the invasion of martial law forces in the National Assembly that night. You can hear these stories in real life. I don't know how much of the president's instructions will be left on the non-Phone, but after martial law was lifted, there is also a story that I told you to put 1,000 people in, not 500 people. In reality, I can declare the emergency rule twice or three times, so just push it in. These stories have actually been reported in the media as testimonies. These things need to be investigated and evidence secured very clearly, but President Yoon Suk Yeol has not cooperated with the investigation, and the security agencies have really prevented all of the presidential office raids. That's why I couldn't even secure the CCTV. In the meantime, there was a lot of destruction of evidence. Then, the time was delayed until here. As a result, the president has never done that in a red-and-red-down manner. And I want to say that saying that I didn't mean to do that doesn't mean that the people are not the ones to be deceived.

[Anchor]
Anyway, the president's statement is contrary to the testimony of each commander anyway, so as you said, former Minister Kim Yong-hyun will attend the impeachment trial the day after tomorrow. Commander Lee Jin-woo and Commander Kwak Jong-geun asked the National Assembly, which serves as prosecutors for attending next month, not to face President Yoon and witnesses, but it seems that President Yoon refuted that.

[Hong Seok-jun]
That doesn't make sense. Because if the witnesses come out and what President Yoon Suk Yeol said is not true, and the judges should understand what the real truth is through the stories of the former commander and former minister Kim Yong-hyun, but if they do not allow them to face each other, wouldn't it be very problematic and limited for the judges to grasp the real truth if they only did this? So, of course, the process of finding out whose story is true or false through cross-examination with the president or stories like that is very important in the current Constitutional Court hearing. If this process is omitted, the actual truth cannot be grasped.

[Anchor]
So, how do direct witnesses make remarks when the commanders face President Yoon? Is it consistent with the testimony that he has made so far? Or will he make direct eye contact with President Yoon and change his remarks in that situation? I think the situation will change a lot depending on this.

[Hyunyoung Shin]
In fact, the impeachment inquiry in the Constitutional Court does not mean that process. In fact, since President Yoon Suk Yeol then judges whether or not such prosecution is necessary for the disciplinary process in impeachment, the credibility of the testimony through antagonistic relations with witnesses seems to be something that can be done later in the court. The part to be considered in the impeachment trial is whether emergency martial law was really achieved when it was appropriate for the situation. You have to think about whether there's really that much ground. Then, in what process was the decree delivered appropriately? And the Constitutional Court has already said it will conduct an intensive hearing on why there was such an intention to invade the National Assembly and the NEC. Therefore, it will not be easy for witnesses to come out and testify in front of President Yoon Suk Yeol. Then, of course, it could be discouraged, and I think it was requested to separate it because of the need for personal protection because it could lead to a reversal of public opinion or suppression of witnesses by far-right supporters.

[Hong Seok-jun]
Now, President Yoon Suk Yeol, former Minister Kim Yong-hyun and other commanders testify together, and if it doesn't happen like that, the problem is that the data that the Constitutional Court has now is the prosecution's investigation data. Under the current law, prosecution data were adopted as evidence in the past, but now the prosecution data statement cannot be adopted as evidence. Therefore, it can only be grasped by the current court testimony of the Constitutional Court. But isn't grasping, for example, the president's call for lawmakers to be pulled out sharply contradicting the prosecution's statement? In order to figure that out in the end, if the commanders are right or wrong, they have to stay with the president and testify in the Constitutional Court.

[Anchor]
I see. In any case, whether you tried to neutralize the National Assembly or directly ordered the lawmakers to be pulled out in the process, this will be a very important criterion for judging the national constitution, so it will be very important for witnesses to testify in the future. President Yoon also argued that it was necessary to confirm the allegations related to fraudulent elections, one of the backgrounds of the declaration of martial law. Let's hear this comment, too.

[President Yoon Suk Yeol: Before declaring martial law, there were many questions ★ about the fairness of the election. ★ As a result of inspecting a small portion of the NIS' computer equipment in October 2023, ★ Try to screen the NEC's computer system in general, not to search for fraudulent elections. ★ It was not to raise such a conspiracy theory that the election was all fraudulent and could not be trusted, but to check the facts. ★. ]

[Anchor]
To reduce President Yoon's remarks, he said that the allegations of fraudulent elections were not resolved, resulting in a national emergency and it was necessary to confirm the facts. Senator Shin, how did you hear it?

[Hyunyoung Shin]
If President Yoon makes such a statement, will many people understand that the president really did emergency martial law that day to screen the election watchdog's computer system? If the president really wanted to do these things with the authority he had, he would have the authority to give instructions under legal procedures and to make sure that they were checked in those areas. Nevertheless, I don't think it can be used as a basis for the rationality or suitability of this emergency rule when it comes to preaching that day's emergency rule, so he appealed a lot of these things, blaming the opposition party, and he denied the rest. In the end, the fact that they deny and admit all the grounds that can act more strongly as evidence in the Constitutional Court trial really needs to be impeached could further strengthen the impeachment hearing. So I think it will be concluded faster.

[Anchor]
Representative Hong.

[Hong Seok-jun]
The fraudulent election itself has tended to be a conspiracy theory so far, to the extreme right. But isn't the most important political decision-making process in the free Republic of Korea finally decided through elections? However, the election process has not changed, and for example, hundreds of invalid votes or votes have been changed since Min Kyung-hoon's constituency was re-voted, and yesterday, the National Intelligence Service, Kisa under the Ministry of Science and Technology, and the Internet Promotion Agency conducted a cyber security audit in 2023. At first, the NEC strongly rejected it and eventually did it, but a cybersecurity audit at the time exposed various cybersecurity problems. There was no basic internal network separation, the password was 12345 and Kim Sook-hee, a representative trace of North Korean hacking, was found. That's why the National Election Commission was weak in cybersecurity.

[Anchor]
So how do you understand that you declared this emergency order to take a picture to see what equipment was used and what systems were operating to see if there was such a rigged election?

[Hong Seok-jun]
So I don't agree that I did emergency martial law to do that, but I had such a considerable question that I went to the Central Election Commission in particular through emergency martial law. Because if you want to go to the Central Election Commission, most of the chairman also serves as the chairman of the Central Election Commission, right? That's why seizure and search are virtually impossible. That's why you said that you did the screen through emergency martial law.

[Anchor]
Let's listen to the closing remarks and wrap it up.

[Hyunyoung Shin]
Emergency martial law is the authority that the president can do in a national emergency. But did these fraudulent elections and such things really cause an emergency in the country? That's not the case at all. That's why I hope the Constitutional Court will make more efforts to overcome the national crisis quickly because I think it was another day to strengthen the results of the impeachment hearing.

[Hong Seok-jun]
Impeachment ultimately determines whether or not to cite impeachment if the president violates the Constitution and laws, and this issue is expected to be the most important issue in the impeachment hearing in the future.

[Anchor]
I see. So far, I have spoken with Hong Seok-joon, a former member of the People's Power, and Shin Hyun-young, a former member of the Democratic Party. Thank you both.